random ONID change (4.3-2545~g23e2089e6)

QAM256

I have TVH build 4.3-2545_g23e2089e6 running and have notice the ONID for one network being randomly set to the same as another. Specifically in regional Queensland, Australia for ABC and SBS. These are both satellite delivered to the area transmission site. It's entirely possible someone in Optus or associated with ABC and SBS are actually changing ABC's network ID to be the same as SBS, perhaps some automated thing who knows but I'd like to make sure that this is actually what is happening rather than a bug in TVH or something else at my end before contacting ABC transmission because it's always an uphill battle to get ABC (or SBS for that matter) to accept there is actually an issue.

Is there a way to have TVH output debug level information that will show the network ID being received in the transport stream with a timestamp so I can tell if it is in the transmission or not when it next happens? The only other thing I can come up with would be to setup another DVB-t receiver and have it parked on ABC continually dumping out the NIT, which I could do but it involves a fair bit of faffing around to do it.

DeltaMikeCharlie

It looks like VAST may be assigned 0x32E1 to 0x32E3, but that was for the network ID, not the ONID.

You can send detailed debugging information to the TVH log via 'Configuration/Debugging'.

Enter the file name, enable 'Debug trace', select the desired subsystems and press "Apply".

https://docs.tvheadend.org/documentation/appendices/debugging

I'd start with tbl and tbl-base and see if you get the information you need.

QAM256

Thanks, that has found something. I'm not actually using VAST, just terrestrial reception. I'm assuming ABC / SBS maintain their separate muxes rolled for their standard transmission sites separately from their VAST services like they used to. It's been a long time since I've pointed a dish and looked.

In my area, Mackay, ABC is on 529.5, SBS on 536.5. ABC's ONID is correct as of right now, but SBS listing 529.5 as the frequency it is operating on. This doesn't really matter in Australia with the way we use DVB-t but could it be that TVH is seeing this and associating ABC on 529.5 as being the same thing and updating its information for ABC to show SBS' ONID? TVH is showing ABC with SBS' ONID

2025-12-12 13:30:41.430 [  DEBUG]:tbl-base: nit: network 3202 (12802) [SBS QLD]
2025-12-12 13:30:41.430 [  DEBUG]:tbl-base: nit:    DVB-T freq 529500000 bw 7MHz cons QAM/64 hier NONE code_rate 3/4:NONE guard 1/16 trans 8k plp_id -1
2025-12-12 13:30:41.430 [  DEBUG]:tbl-base: nit:  onid 3202 (12802) tsid 03B0 (944) mux 536.5MHz in FTA

DeltaMikeCharlie

In Sydney, SBS is ONID 12802 (0x3202) and ABC is 4112 (0x1010).

https://www.freetv.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/OP-40-Allocation-of-DVB-Service-Information-Codes-Issue-4-Sept-2017-v2..pdf

It looks like maybe SBS are using their NID instead of their ONID.

From table 7, it looks like SBS ONID should be 0x1011.

EDIT: I found another table. Both ABC and SBS appear to be incorrect.

https://www.freetv.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/Free-TV-Australia-DTTB-Service-Information-Register-Ver-13-September-2019-QLD.pdf

DeltaMikeCharlie

You could also get a second opinion. You could take a mux dump and then analyse it with something like DVB Inspector or TS Duck.

QAM256

In so far as what is being received in my area everything is correct as far as ABC and SBS not having the same ONID. If I disable all muxes bar ABC and perform a network scan ABC's ONID displays correctly in TVH. Enable SBS as well and ABC's ONID changes to SBS'.

ABC

2025-12-12 13:29:20.607 [  DEBUG]:tbl-base: sdt: onid 1010 (4112) tsid 0243 (579)
2025-12-12 13:29:20.607 [  DEBUG]:tbl-base: sdt: mux 529.5MHz in FTA
2025-12-12 14:40:34.665 [  DEBUG]:tbl-base: nit: network 3254 (12884) [ABC Queensland]
2025-12-12 14:40:34.665 [  DEBUG]:tbl-base: nit:  onid 1010 (4112) tsid 0243 (579) mux 529.5MHz in FTA

SBS

2025-12-12 13:30:41.430 [  DEBUG]:tbl-base: sdt: onid 3202 (12802) tsid 03B0 (944)
2025-12-12 13:30:41.430 [  DEBUG]:tbl-base: sdt: mux 536.5MHz in FTA
2025-12-12 13:30:41.430 [  DEBUG]:tbl-base: nit: network 3202 (12802) [SBS QLD]
2025-12-12 13:30:41.430 [  DEBUG]:tbl-base: nit:    DVB-T freq 529500000 bw 7MHz cons QAM/64 hier NONE code_rate 3/4:NONE guard 1/16 trans 8k plp_id -1
2025-12-12 13:30:41.430 [  DEBUG]:tbl-base: nit:  onid 3202 (12802) tsid 03B0 (944) mux 536.5MHz in FTA

DeltaMikeCharlie

QAM256 Enable SBS as well and ABC's ONID changes to SBS'.

That seems odd. I'm not sure what to suggest other than the Mux Dump to see what is actually being transmitted.

QAM256

There's nothing in the tables that I can see that is an issue bar SBS' NIT referring to 529.5. The TVH debug doesn't show anything unusual beyond that. Raw dumps of the tables, same. Nicely presented output of tsreader, same.

Frankly it sounds like an issue with TVH not liking that frequency being both used by a 'network' that does not list it, and having listed in another.

Is there anyone here that is involved in the TVH project that can offer any insight?

DeltaMikeCharlie

QAM256 Is there anyone here that is involved in the TVH project that can offer any insight?

I recommend that you provide a detailed description of the symptoms that you are experiencing (no video, garbled audio, wrong EPG) and someone more capable may be able to provide assistance. Please include any client software that you may be using like Kodi, etc.

QAM256

Bloody hell. Just how much more detail do you need! I've litterally stated the precise problem in clear plain language. ABC is getting SBS' ONID set.

Anyway, it's clearly a bug in TVH. Idiot grade work around, change ABC's frequency to 529.625 thereby breaking the linkage between SBS' including 529.5 in its NIT and suddenly ABC no longer gets updated to SBS' ONID. TVH is using the (for want of a better term) "I'm on this frequency" in the NIT and when that field isn't present falls back to the frequency requested sent to the tuner. It discovers ABC and SBS are 'apparently' on the same frequency therefore must be the same mux, set ONID to be the same.

DaveH

QAM256 Bloody hell. Just how much more detail do you need! I've litterally stated the precise problem in clear plain language.

Shooting the messenger generally isn't considered helpful. I'm just a user, so I know I can't help, and that goes for most people reading this. DMC has engaged with you about a problem that perhaps is affecting just you, and he has a pretty good understanding of TVH and TVH resources and of Australian TV. So he's suggested what he thinks you need to do if you want to get a fix for your problem. I'd suggest calming down and trying to follow his suggestion.

DeltaMikeCharlie

@DaveH - Thanks for your kind words.

The OP has a workaround that appears to have resolved the issue for them. Perhaps future users encountering similar issues could try that workaround too.

As far as I could tell, there was no operational issue with TVH. That is, there was no problem tuning to and using those services. This could be a rare phenomenon or a common one that nobody has noticed.

As for the root cause, unfortunately, we may never know for certain. There may indeed be a bug in TVH, the OP's local NIT may contain spurious/unexpected data or maybe a bit of both.

DaveH

DeltaMikeCharlie Thanks for the update 🙂