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tvheadend unicable 2 Jess dvb-s tutorial waverider torodial t90

Added by jody gugelhop over 1 year ago

Okidoki folks, this is my dish tutorial & questions thread - work in progress

First of all my hardware:

Dish: wavefrontier toroidal 90
LNBs: Inverto wideband IDLP-WDB01-OO­PRO-OPP
Multiswitches: Inverto IDLU-UWT110-CUO1O-32P (package also contains Power Inserter, but I don't use them, because from Dish to Receiver/computer it is maybe 10 meters not more)
Combiner: Inverto IDLU-UCM1O1-OOO2O-OPP
Receiver/DVB-S Karte: Digital Devices Max SX8 supports unicable 2 Jess
Also have the Inverto SatPal for programming and finding satellites.

For the moment I have 4 wideband LNBs that are connected to 2 multiswitches, and use the combiner to have one cable coming to my receiver/computer.

I run Arch Linux 5.4.2 with tvheadend 4.3.r1428.gbef96c5d2-1.

If you run a recent kernel then dvb-s card is running out of the box but you need to configure it for your usage. There is an installation description here:
https://manuals.digitaldevices.de/sections/modules/output/output_en.php?product_short=max_sx8

I just needed to configure the mode. I want it to be in unicable jess mode, so I can use one single cable to have it run on 8 tuners (also described on the site above).

echo 'options ddbridge fmode=3' | sudo tee /etc/modprobe.d/ddbridge.conf

Then I started tvheadend, all the 8 tuners show up and when setting them to unicable 2 and setting the frequencies and Pin, they turn all green.
I still need to figure out what to put/fill in the other fields.


Replies (8)

RE: tvheadend unicable 2 Jess dvb-s tutorial waverider torodial t90 - Added by VenimK Mac over 1 year ago

jody gugelhop wrote:

Okidoki folks, this is my dish tutorial & questions thread - work in progress

First of all my hardware:

Dish: wavefrontier toroidal 90
LNBs: Inverto wideband IDLP-WDB01-OO­PRO-OPP
Multiswitches: Inverto IDLU-UWT110-CUO1O-32P (package also contains Power Inserter, but I don't use them, because from Dish to Receiver/computer it is maybe 10 meters not more)
Combiner: Inverto IDLU-UCM1O1-OOO2O-OPP
Receiver/DVB-S Karte: Digital Devices Max SX8 supports unicable 2 Jess
Also have the Inverto SatPal for programming and finding satellites.

For the moment I have 4 wideband LNBs that are connected to 2 multiswitches, and use the combiner to have one cable coming to my receiver/computer.

I run Arch Linux 5.4.2 with tvheadend 4.3.r1428.gbef96c5d2-1.

If you run a recent kernel then dvb-s card is running out of the box but you need to configure it for your usage. There is an installation description here:
https://manuals.digitaldevices.de/sections/modules/output/output_en.php?product_short=max_sx8

I just needed to configure the mode. I want it to be in unicable jess mode, so I can use one single cable to have it run on 8 tuners (also described on the site above).

echo 'options ddbridge fmode=3' | sudo tee /etc/modprobe.d/ddbridge.conf

Then I started tvheadend, all the 8 tuners show up and when setting them to unicable 2 and setting the frequencies and Pin, they turn all green.
  • I still need to figure out what to put/fill in the other fields.*

Can you be more specific ...

RE: tvheadend unicable 2 Jess dvb-s tutorial waverider torodial t90 - Added by jody gugelhop over 1 year ago

For instance in the pic below:

How do i know which "Network A" is what is on a, b, c, or d or can i select something at random?
What would be "SCR (ID)", "PIN", and "Frequency" and anything that I need to adjust in the "Advanced Settings" below that?

RE: tvheadend unicable 2 Jess dvb-s tutorial waverider torodial t90 - Added by Stephen Neal 9 months ago

Apologies for necro-posting but I'm just getting in to Unicable II stuff.

The SCR ID is likely to be the user band, the PIN is the Unicabll II PIN (used to stop multi-dwelling set-ups controlling each others' user bands) and the Frequency is the IF frequency allocated to the user band in question. The Network A, B, C and D are the 4 satellite positions that the Unicable standard supports and which TV Headend network is associated with them (so you'd have a different network for each satellite as an example). Because each adaptor can receive from up to 4 satellites, you can associate each adaptor with up to 4 satellites - and it will switch between them as required.

My Due Sat DPC32K has 32 user bands in JESS/Unicable II mode and as a default they are :

SCR CH1 (which may be ID 0 - not sure) PIN 37 Frequency 1210MHz - looking at the example which has the same settings, it appears the ID is Channel ID-1 (So SCR CH1 = ID0)
SCR CH2 PIN 18 Frequency 1420MHz
SCR CH3 PIN 251 Frequency 1680MHz

SCR CH1-8 are used by both EN5094 (Unicable I) and EN50607 (JESS/Unicable II) standards, whilst 9-32 are EN50607 only.

The way Unicable works is that the satellite cable carries up to 32 separate frequency bands (8 for Unicable I)- one band for each tuner. The Unicable II LNBs or multiswitches then select, under tuner control, which transponder should be sent on that frequency band (i.e. the LNB/multiswitch tunes to that transponder). As Unicable is often used for multiple households in apartment buildings, PINs are applied to each band to ensure only the allocated household can retune their band. If you have 2 x 2 satellite multiswitches, each switch will only use the user band if a tuner requests a satellite that it is connected to an LNB for, otherwise it will switch off that user band, allowing another multiswitch to use it (and avoiding clashes with a simple combiner). So the two multiswitches need to be programmed to be either A/B or C/D if working in 4 satellite mode.

Each LNB can be set to one of four A-D positions, with dual wideband multiswitches allowing two positions (A-B or C-D). I think it's vital that both multiswitches have identical SCR ID-PIN-Frequency configs to ensure that the AB and CD switching works correctly.

The SatPal can be used to reprogram the PINs, User band frequencies etc., which satellite positions the multiswitch carries, and also for multiple output switches whether two outputs carry 32 bands and 1 legacy, 2 x 16 band outputs etc.

It's also possible to program some Unicable II switches to run with static tuning (to carry a fixed 32 transponder list - with each user band dedicated to a fixed transponder). ISTR that this will work with non-Unicable II equipment (though will have non-standard transponder settings so will need a blind scan or similar) and will feed an unlimited number of receivers.

RE: tvheadend unicable 2 Jess dvb-s tutorial waverider torodial t90 - Added by jody gugelhop 9 months ago

thanks for your feedback and insights Stephan. As a matter of fact I still need to finish my setup although the dish has been sitting there almost for year so still very relevant for me!! :)

RE: tvheadend unicable 2 Jess dvb-s tutorial waverider torodial t90 - Added by Stephen Neal 9 months ago

Yep - I'm converting a Sky Q wideband LNB - which was installed for Sky Q at 28.2E (and is still used for that) to also add Unicable I/II compatibility so I can feed SAT>IP tuners and a FTA Zapper. I'm using a Durasat DPC-32K multiswitch (the H and V wideband is passed though to the Sky Q box). Annoyingly the Sky Q LNB is 10.41 not 10.40GHz local oscillator so I have to reconfigure the LNB settings in the tuners - but it's working OK now.

Interested in your experiences of the T90 - I've been very tempted by them as I'd like to get a number of satellites between 28.2 E and 5W - though I may not be able to with a single dish due to nearby trees outside my property, and regional restrictions on dish positions...

Do you need any more assistance in config of networks?

A Network in TV Headend is usually used to configure the transponders (DVB-S/S2) or multiplexes (DVB-T/T2 and DVB-C) that you want to be able to receive. Normally you'd have a network per satellite position. You can either use pre-stored satellite lists - which will then autopopulate the muxes (aka transponders) used for that network in the TVHeadned muxes list, or you can manually add muxes (it will prompt you to select which network the mux is for)

You then associate the network with tuner or tuners (and in some cases Diseqc or Unicable I/II position locations for that tuner)

Example 1:

2 x LNBs with single outputs - one pointed at 19.2E, the other at 28.2E - each directly connected to a tuner input.

Tuner 1 would be associated with an 'Astra 19.2E' network, and all the transponders for Astra 19.2 would be associated with that network.
Tuner 2 would be associated with an 'Astra 28.2E' network, and all the transponders for Astra 28.2 would be associated with that network.

Example 2:

4 tuners, all connected to separate outputs of a Quad LNB pointed at Astra 28.2.
Tuners 1 to 4 would all be associated with an Astra 28.2E network, with the transponders for Astra 28.2 associated with that network.

Example 3:

2 x single output LNBs (one at 28.2, one at 19.2) connected via an A/B Diseqc switch to a single tuner.

Tuner 1 would then be configured with 2 networks - 'Astra 28.2' for position A, 'Astra 19.2' for position B etc.

Example 4:

2 x Wideband LNBs pointed at 28.2 and 19.2 via a Unicable II multiswitch, connected to a 4 input tuner.

The 4 tuners will each be allocated an SCR user band and PIN at a given frequency. The 4 tuners can all be allocated an Astra 28.2 network for position A, and a 19.2 network for position B. The tuners will then tell the multiswitch which LNB/position to switch to each user band when they request to tune a given user band to a given transponder.

e.g.
Tuner 1 will send the signal via Unicable II to the multiswitch 'Please tune SCR Channel 1 - which is allocated to me and is at 1210MHz with PIN 37 - to Satellite Position A (selecting 28.2E LNB is to be tuned) and the transponder at 10.847GHz with Vertical polarisation' - that will then send that Astra 28.2E transponder shifted to 1210MHz down the cable
Tuner 2 might then send a signal via Unicable II to the multiswich 'Please tune SCR Channel 2 - which is allocated to me and is at 1420MHz with PIN 18 - to Satellite Position B (sleeting 19.2E LNB is to be tuned) and the transponder at 11.361GHz with Horizontal polarisation' - that will then send that Astra 19.2E transponder shifted to 1420MHz down the same cable.
(NB TV Headend seems to use an N-1 numbering scheme - so SCR Channel 1 is ID 0, SCR Channel 2 is ID 1 etc.)

RE: tvheadend unicable 2 Jess dvb-s tutorial waverider torodial t90 - Added by jody gugelhop 9 months ago

Hi Stephan :)

thank you for your input. I'm currently not at home, traveling for work (even in these times...) so in case I do when back I will let you know :)
As for the T90: I did quite some research into which dish to buy. I definitely wanted to go with only one dish. There are multiple versions of the T90 out there but in essence they do not really differ much, except the back part how you attach it to a rod or wall... I think the original company does not really exist anymore. Anyhow, the manual that was in the package to assemble it was pretty crappy but I found some pdf versions on the net and figured it out in the end though i had some left over screws.

Getting satellites between 28.2 E and 5W with the T90 will not be a problem, (though fine-tuning might drive you a little crazy, but maybe i'm just not patient enough). The only thing you need to figure out is which satellites you want and if you can fit the LNBs on the rail next to each other. Some satellites might be too close to each other so that normal LNBs will not fit. There are some smaller LNBs that can be used but at the time I could not find any that also supported the unicable 2. I have a bunch of sites about multi LNB sites for the T90, some in German and/or Dutch though, but google translate is not bad:

https://www.satlex.us/en/wavefrontier_calc.html (also nice tool to calculate distance to object from dish for satellites for reception)

http://www.svenali.de/index.php/t90inst

http://www.duwgati.com/wavefrontier/

https://www.sat-universe.com/showthread.php?t=206242

https://www.satelliteguys.us/xen/threads/wave-frontier-toroidal-t-90-satellite-dish.77005/

RE: tvheadend unicable 2 Jess dvb-s tutorial waverider torodial t90 - Added by Stephen Neal 9 months ago

Thanks for this. My problem is trees at the bottom of my garden, and I live in a conservation area which means dishes cannot be visible from outside my property (so need to be mounted low). Challenging... A T90 would be great if it weren't for these constraints.

I've done a lot of reading on them - and like you I think that the original T90 manufacturer no longer exists, but clones from companies (sometimes with very similar names) are still being made. The importance of slim-body LNBs is clear for close orbital positions. The advent of Unicable II and wideband LNBs has made multi-tuner, multi-sat solutions far more achievable without thousands of cables and multiswitches and diseqc switches too.

My German isn't terrible, and I also speak Swedish, so kind of get a bit of Dutch reading comprehension for free - and Google Translate is always helpful!

RE: tvheadend unicable 2 Jess dvb-s tutorial waverider torodial t90 - Added by jody gugelhop 2 months ago

I have had some more time trying to get stuff working. The dish is now set/oriented & tested to receive satellites but i'm not able to get it working in tvheadend. These are the settings of the switches

I then use the pin and frequencies in tvh accordingly:

Just to avoid that I might set something wrong in the network A/B/C/D settings i set them all to the same satellite (only for testing purposes) that I know the dish/lnb is receiving.
Then I added a bunch of muxes for that satellite and run scans but nothing is received, all fail.
I do not know what I might be doing wrong, any input is welcome, thank you in advance :)

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